New Weekly Voting Incentive: PUCK AND THE GANG GO TO RIVERDALE!!!
For a long time, people have noted that Puck plays out a little like a demented version of Archie, so I thought, “Why not?” This month, a vote for Puck on TWC gets you a look at my progress on a Puck and Phoebe Double Digest cover!
CLICK HERE TO VOTE FOR PUCK! TONY THE TIGER WANTS YOU TO!
As for this comic…
Hey, look! Two male characters are talking to each other! You might have noticed that this is a relatively rare occurrence in this comic. I’m proud to say that the Puck archive passes the Bechdel test quite frequently. At a glance, I counted about 113 strips where two female characters converse about something other than a male character. It’s the reverse Bechdel test (two males conversing about something other than a female) where this comic usually fails. Only 13 strips in the entire run vaguely come close to passing reverse Bechdel test, and almost all of those are the ‘Sigmund and Satan’ comics. Maybe I missed a few, though. Feel free to count!
I’m not even sure if this particular comic qualifies for passing the reverse Bechdel test, but I’ll include it in the count because their conversation is ostensibly about a shower, which, technically speaking, is not a female character. So that makes 14.
Of course, this bias toward female conversation in Puck has less to do with forward thinking or gender equality than it does with my penchant for drawing girls and my general discomfort with male social patterns. And though many of my comics theoretically pass the Bechdel test, I feel like some should be disqualified on account of the female characters wearing bikinis.
That said, I never write anything to pass some form of test. I write the comic because… Well, I… Why do I write this comic anyway? Honestly, your guess is as good as mine.
I have been following your comic for quite awhile now and I just wanted to say thanks for all your hard work. Every Monday night I get a pretty good laugh and Puck. Again thanks and please keep up the hard work.
Aw shucks. Thanks for letting me know. It always helps to know that someone’s reading and enjoying. Which is the real reason I do these things, beyond some weird internal drive.
Men spying on the sacred rituals of women never ends well, at least in Greek drama.
And it wouldn’t end well here if it were allowed. But it’s not. And while (I think) Colin and his dad are both not overly smart, they’re not dumb enough to stick around.
I honestly hope you write it because it’s fun/entertaining/good challenge, not because you feel obliged to do it.
Back to the strip in itself… if the tree didn’t fall far from the apple, wouldn’t he be okay to watch from a distance while eating popcorn ? As long as he is forewarned ?
Yeah, I’d guess that his presence wouldn’t be an issue, really, though you never know. Those patriarchs get defensive of their womenfolk sometimes.
And yes, I do feel obliged to do this comic, but to a certain extent, that’s why I started a webcomic. The truth of the matter is (for most creative types) that the artistic process is rarely fun. It can be rewarding, but it can be a real nightmare sometimes. It’s always easier to not do something than do it, and in the years where I wasn’t working on Puck, I’d all too often decide to not do something, night after night. The excuses were legion: I was tired, or I wasn’t ‘in the zone’, or whatever. The fact that I have a weekly webcomic forces me to get off my butt and actually draw something. The obligation is there, and sometimes I resent it, but to be frank, it’s the only reason I’m doing anything creatively. And something is better than nothing. I think.
It’s good to find motivation by keeping a deadline, but please tell me that you find joy in seeing a job well done, and in our appreciation of it!
Art is also created for the artist!
Often, the creation creates the creator.
Oooh. Deep. I look at this way. At the end of the day, I can say, “Well, I lived a good life, cared for the people around me, did my best to find happiness and I produced ‘x’ creative output,” or I can say, “Well I lived a good life, cared for the people around me, did my best to find happiness and produced f#$% all.” In the big scheme of things, I guess there’s not much difference, but I like being productive.
The one I don’t get, though, are the people who say, “Well, I lived a terrible, miserable, lonely life, but dang it if I didn’t produce some killer creative output!” F@#$ that noise. Life has to be worth living. It’s all we’ve got.
Art is certainly created for the artist, but to quote my favorite poet (Ovid), “Writing without a readership is like dancing in the dark.” He wrote that during his exile to the Black Sea, where he was surrounded by people who didn’t speak his version of Latin. It sucked. And that’s why I’m glad I’ve got you guys. I worked for a full decade on tons of projects that no one ever saw, and it nearly killed my creative drive entirely. Any motivation I have is found in the knowledge that someone out there enjoys what I do on some level. The internal motivation, sadly, is at a low ebb right now. Art’s created for the artist, in a sense, but (a) I don’t dare consider what I do to be art, and (b) creative types endlessly struggle with the failings of their creations.
Sometimes I think I’m doing something that’s worth doing; most of the time I don’t, and I think it’s garbage. But the great thing is that I have a few vocal people like you (whose opinions I trust, because they’re not me) who tell me that I’m not making total crap. So thanks for that. It really does keep me going.
1: It certainly IS Art, and appreciated by a lot of people. Anyone who tells you otherwise is, IMHO, a snob that doesn’t have an original thought in his head.
(this is coming from a snob who only has 2 or 3 original ideas in his head, btw).
2: As far as “total crap”, As an English Prof, I’m sure you already know that Shakespeare said the same thing about “Midsummer Night’s Dream”. (“Well, shown, Moon”!.
You may also be interested in knowing that that’s what Tchaikovsky said about “The Nutcracker”, which is probably the most popular thing he ever wrote.
I prefer to call it ‘creative output’. The ‘art’ types have long snubbed comic types as populist panderers (probably some truth to that), and quite frankly, I crave no part of their insular artsy society. So whether it’s art or it’s just what you like, I’m cool with it. And yes, as the Tchaikovsky example so wonderfully shows, an artist often has little real perspective on whether a work will resonate with the world at large. When I first started posting stuff on the interwebs, I held off putting up my old Puck comics for years because I thought they looked so awful. Then it turned out that people really liked them. Go figure.
Hey Sammy Davis Jr hated two songs he was contracted to sing so much, he declared he would sing each of them one time and one time only for the recording.
The two songs… ‘Mister Bojangles’ and ‘The Candyman can’.
These two songs took the #1 and #2 slots in the charts at the same time. It was the first time in history the #1 and #2 songs were on one record.
Seems Sammy had to sing them a few more times over the next 2 decades.
I can see why he hated them. I like neither of them, though I love me some Sammy.
I think that creative types know what speaks to them, but they sometimes have a hard time knowing what speaks to others. Which is why things always get kind of weird when a creative type gets ‘too big to question.’ (Cough cough George Lucas cough.) You need somebody else to put in valuable input. Sammy had managers who knew what they were doing.
Colin’s Dad I doubt fully comprehends what is about to happen. I’d almost like to see him try to peek. Almost.
I think the voting incentive didn’t update, it still shows last week’s image.
Might not go live until it’s the 18th wherever you are. TWC has changed their system so that you can’t update a voting incentive on the same day. Which is stupid. Which I’ve complained about, but what are you going to do?
It is working here in mountain time right now.
Well, good to know!
I remember talking to my girlfriend (when I first found out about this comic) about the Bechdel test (at the time, she was studying it for a school project).
I commented on it being rare for dude’s to talk to each other (including about females; exception being anything related to Satan and Sigmund, basically).
Initially, she didn’t really believe me.
Then she started reading when I began reading one, causing her to get hooked.
…She now agrees that this comic is the complete opposite of that test.
As for you making the comic, it’s in reality your choice (and life) if you do it. Still, it’s a good idea to do it if it keeps you motivated not to post-pone stuff literally no reason (I tend to do that because I’m lazy as hell…)
When a comic’s overwhelmingly female-centric, I guess that happens. Oh well. I tend to find that I’m not great at drawing guys, which might potentially stem from the fact that I find guys kind of boring to draw. The super-muscular hero types are fun to draw, I guess, but in a comic like this? Satan’s fun to draw; I’ll say that much.
As for the production part, I’m lazy as hell but am really motivated by deadlines, so this weekly thing works.
I personally find the Bechdel test a woefully poor measuring stick to gauge sexism.
For those that don’t know, the Bechdel Test measures two things in a work:
1. Do female characters actually talk to each other.
2. Do they talk about something other than men.
Plenty of works fail the test but are still good for women, and plenty of works pass the test but are horrible.
My comic passes the test with flying colors, though I wouldn’t say that’s worth much.
You do good work. You present women in a positive light while not oversexualizing them. Yes, they get sexy, but when it makes sense. You present them in a fairly balanced light, the good and the bad. I would say that’s far better than some other works that pass the bechdel test but actually are still very sexist.
Well, glad I’ve got your vote. At least one third of my readership is female, so there must be something there that’s working for them.
I figured the women at this party would at least *discuss* the inadequecies of the men in their lives…that’s what normal women do at things like this…but, as we all know, few of the characters (and certainly none of the regulars) are what you’d call *normal*.
They’re not normal, by any means, and though I know women take part in those discussions, I don’t think these women take part in those discussions. Puck accepts that Colin is a well-meaning moron, and I think she feels no motivation to discuss that obvious truth with others; Phoebe (wisely) doesn’t have a man to complain about; Daphne has a pseudo-boyfriend, but you’re not given the right to complain about your man until you’ve actually legitimately started dating. As for the others, Tracee and Heather both gain a sense of power through their men, so complaining about them would do nothing but diminish their potential power and social standing.
I work with a lot of women, am friends with lots of women, and I have to say that the women I know don’t endlessly complain about their guys. I’ve met women who do, but they’re always annoying weirdos.
Dad, ever the subtle one.
Old people often lose their subtlety along with their agility, strength and everything else. I know a number of old folks who are as rude as small children.
careful, dad, if your wife or daughter see you drooling over tits like that, you´ll be in trouble….and if you see the state the boobed ones will be in upon your return, you´ll be glad you missed the action 😉
These patriarchal big money types are always given a much longer leash than they should be with this type of behaviour, though. This is why you’ll periodically see news stories about the rampant sexism and harassment that goes on in big business, law, politics, etc., and the perpetrators are always indignant and shocked, because they’ve spent their stupid, privileged white guy lives being indulged by a culture that permits that sort of garbage. I think dad here would be in less trouble than one would assume. Which is sort of sad.
I believe you mentioned that your wife said something about that outfit being rather… er, “your husband wants me,” or words to that effect.
Rather prophetic, that.
Hey, that’s what the outfit is for!
Yeah, but I figured that was meant to be a joke and not actually happen.
POP CORN! PEANUTS! GET YER HOT NUTS HERE! POP CORN! BODY ARMOR! GET ‘EM WHILE THEY’RE HOT!
don’t judge me I need the money.
Hey, we’re all at ringside. None of us are allowed to judge.
I’ll take one of those clear plastic ponchos please…. and a coke?
Where is the next button? Oh, hell, I’m all caught up! That’s what I get for binge comic reading, I guess!
The next button shall appear with regular frequency on Monday nights. It’s … going to get much slower from this point onward.
Slower? as one who has read your entire comic (a couple times, now), I can say time wait seems overpowering sometimes.
It’s just a tribute to the quality.
Or (more likely) a tribute to painfully slow update schedules. I never know what the right answer is with that. My preference is to take my time and release the strips on a weekly basis, with the comics looking the way I want them to. That’s what I do now, but I know that the slow update schedule is one of the primary reasons Puck isn’t more popular than it is. It’s a really big ask of a readership to wait on a weekly timeline for a story-based webcomic. Most don’t have the patience. It’s different if you’ve got a gag panel comic where each comic stands on its own, but that’s not what I’ve got.
The other option is to seriously compromise the visuals and start churning these things out using a simpler, quicker style, probably drawing the whole thing on a tablet. (Traditional inking, scanning and all that takes a ton of time.) If I were smart, I’d probably go that route. But I’m not smart. I’m stubborn.
I, for one, think the time we have to wait for the comics to come out just adds to the excitement. Plus, it gives me time to go through the comments and go back and find things I missed in previous comics. Don’t be too hard on yourself, they’re great comics that are definitely worth the wait, and the wait definitely makes the readership appreciate the comics more (at least in my humble opinion).
Well, glad to know it works for some readers. Thanks. I know it’s not the ‘recommended’ update schedule for story-based webcomics, but it’s nice to hear that everyone isn’t annoyed by it.
Jocelyn is right. The wait does make the comic better.
You are also right to ensure the quality of the comic instead of rushing it.
“Isn’t more popular than it is”??? are you kidding? you’re ahead of Girl Genius on TWC right now, and I’ve loved Phil Foglio since Aaaz and Skeeve back in the 80’s! (“Another fine Myth” for people who didn’t get the reference).
Dude, I look at a lot of the crap that’s ahead of you, and though some of it deserves to be there, the rest???
Well, Girl Genius doesn’t promote TWC anymore. From the looks of it, they stopped doing incentive pics in 2008. My last voting incentive pic was … last week. All the REALLY big boys don’t care one bit what their TWC ranking is because the boost in pageviews (maybe 3k-6k a day for being at the TOP top of the list, from my experience) is negligible for them when they’re scoring over 100k views a day on their own steam.
I have a following, and don’t get me wrong: I don’t want to be unappreciative of the following I have. I know tons of people WAY more talented than me who have very few readers. I am thankful. It’s just that I try really, really hard to grow the readership, and it’s been stuck at zero growth (to slightly shrinking) for years. And it would be easy to ‘fix’, because I know the elements of my comic that chase off readers. If I wanted to crank up those pageviews, I’d need to (1) update at least three times a week with a quicker, dirtier style, (2) drop the long narrative arcs and go for self-contained gags chock full of pop culture refs (easily retweeted!) and (3) eliminate the character humor and character development because, well, characters take time to get to know, and lots of people don’t have time. They have time for gag jokes about Batman; that’s it.
I wouldn’t be the first to switch over. My good friend Bill Taylor of Tripp is ending his story-based, character-heavy comic and going to a gag-a-day pop culture joke setup soon. I don’t blame him. I’ve expressed my incredible sorrow over the loss of one of the best story-based comedy strips on the internet, but he’s got the right idea, from a business standpoint.
Of course, if I made those types of changes, I’d be making a comic I wouldn’t really want to make. I’d also be making a comic that would totally chase away most of my established readership, because you guys generally share my love for weird character-based humor. There aren’t many of us out there, but…
Yeah, I guess I should just be happy with what I’ve got.
I must be living in a bubble: because I frankly do not know what “really big boys” you mean… Almost all the “big boys” I know are on TWC, and the vast majority of them have ongoing stories. (Apparently some even make a living from this…)
Several of those I read initially started out as gag-a-day strips, but moved to larger arcs or even ongoing stories with time. It’s just way easier to do something interesting this way — those sticking with the gag-a-day format usually run out of good ideas pretty fast, or only rarely had really good ideas to begin with. I find very few of these worth reading over a long time.
Those that do switch from making ambitious “graphic novels” to a gag-a-day strip format, usually seem to do so in order to reduce their time investment, as such strips usually have *way* simpler graphics.
I agree that more frequent updates seem to help in general. (Though for the past couple of years at least, most of the time the #1 spot on TWC has been occupied by another comic with weekly updates…)
From a “business” point of view, it would certainly be prudent to save a bit of time on certain details that hardly anyone notices anyway, unless you point us to them explicitly… But then, I tend to be a perfectionist myself, so I totally understand that this is not really an option 🙂
Apart from that, I wonder how much difference regular voting incentives at TWC really make?
No, you’re right. Many of the really big ones are story-driven. Really big ones might be on TWC, but they don’t promote it or push it. (I’m thinking comics like Questionable Content, Penny Arcade, Homestuck, etc.) The only reason I get any votes is the voting incentive pics. If it weren’t for that, my votes would be nil.
So did he just blatantly ignore that she had a tail and horns? Maybe the tail isn’t visible, but still, the horns.
Funny. No one ever seems to notice.
Some things are better left unexplained. Perhaps Dr. Exposition could have lectured bored students, early in the series, on the glamour that creatures like Puck and company cast on human around them so they wouldn’t be bothered with Vulcan jokes, but it’s more respectful of the audience or more fun to let us invent explanations of on our own.
Also: I’m a little worried about the flower in panel 4. Has its dirt dried out, or is that water which has gone too long without a change?
(Also: was the cabinet door busted during a recent party, or is it just a visual symbol of the gradual deterioration that comes with having kids?)
Also Also: Tracee’s glance and smirk in panel 3 is a wonderful contrast to Phoebe’s oblivious Hooterwalk in panel 2. I don’t know how you got that derriere in panel 4 to smirk as well. Finally the shading change from panel to panel was an interesting way to tie together the gradual flooding of male hormones, until it’s washed away by the conceptual cold shower at the end.
I guess what I’m trying to say is that, yes, you may put too much work into the thing, but we like the result!
The flower in panel four has been in that condition forever. Seriously, check out earlier comics. It’s always there. Same thing with the cupboard door off its hinges. It predates the baby and is more a symbol of their life being in a total shambles. (It also bears an uncanny resemblance to my current kitchen, which is a disgusting disaster. What can I say? I ain’t very handy.)
I did want the stark difference in personality between Phoebe and Tracee to be apparent in panels two and three. And I’m not sure whether that’s male hormones flooding the room or hotness vibes. Either or. But thanks for noticing.
You say that as though there’s something wrong with a tail.
Well…at least Colin’s dad isn’t totally a stuff. He still knows nice when he sees it. 🙂
He has good taste for a man with such an awful mustache, I suppose.
Props to Colin’s Dad for still appreciating some fine looking women. I hear he still chases a pretty girl, then when he catches her, forgets why.
You never forget why, friend. You just forget how.
nah, the head don’t forget how. Other parts of the body just decide they won’t do it anymore.
True enough. Le sigh.
im gonna have to say the green dress is better. more is sometimes better :p
That’s also intended. Phoebe skirts bad taste, but often stops just inside the boundaries. Tracee is just unrestrained, and that sometimes makes her steez less … steezy?
steez or sleeze?
I find they tend to be interchangeable.
Well, I do kinda like Tracee’s dress as well… Not that I approve of her running around almost naked — but she does it in quite a clever, almost tasteful way 🙂 I guess the elegant colours contribute to that quite significantly.
Also, she has a hat.
I try to make her have a sort of classy trashiness. I’m glad someone appreciates.
just commenting on the voting incentive, I’m an Archie reader. Yeah I agree with you. I’m leery about letting my kids look at those.
What’s hilarious is that this particular cover I generated is WAY tamer than lots of the highly suggestive stuff that makes its way onto the REAL covers. Like, I don’t know, maybe this stuff was all cool in 1946, but today? Not so much.
Maybe it is the Scot in me coming out Gecko but you really need to lower the price on your fake Puck and Phoebe comic… After all that work, do you really want a price of 75.00 bucks US to be your biggest joke in that strip? :^P
Yes. Yes I do.
Love the “alt” text on that one — made me laugh pretty hard 🙂 I’m wondering whether I have seen something along these lines before… But definitely not in such a funny context 🙂
On a similar note, I’m not sure whether I stole that line from somewhere, but if I did, it wasn’t consciously.
Grand-papa MacTavish, get the hell out. Even if they say they want you, they don’t want you.
Use this time. Spend it with . . . well anyone. Colin could use some attention.
Collin, good man.
Agreed. Wholeheartedly.